PROJECT ND: Parts Development, Testing, Measurements, DYNO

Miata Parts, Intakes, Superchargers, Headers, Exhausts, Shocks, Springs, Sway Bars, Brake Kits, Autocross and track mods.

Re: PROJECT ND: Parts Development, Testing, Measurements, DY

Postby NathanD277 » Fri Sep 01, 2017 4:22 pm

Are you running the LTH or shorty? It looks like the LTH, just checking.
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Re: PROJECT ND: Parts Development, Testing, Measurements, DY

Postby Brian » Fri Sep 01, 2017 9:07 pm

Pulled the pic for now but YES...LTH.
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Re: PROJECT ND: Parts Development, Testing, Measurements, DY

Postby Brian » Wed Sep 06, 2017 11:05 am

Grassroots MotorSports Magazine Testing of our Progress Sways...which were developed on this ND.
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Capture+_2017-09-06-11-03-03.png
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Re: PROJECT ND: Parts Development, Testing, Measurements, DY

Postby awales74 » Wed Sep 06, 2017 3:44 pm

Nice write up. Always wish they could get more similar before/after pictures to really see difference.
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Re: PROJECT ND: Parts Development, Testing, Measurements, DY

Postby Brian » Wed Sep 13, 2017 1:46 pm

Folks ask me what we run for oil with E85 and this is it. The 20-50 is used in our Racing NC, and 10-30 in this ND. This is a Nitro & Alcohol approved oil, no need for this if not racing with E85.
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Re: PROJECT ND: Parts Development, Testing, Measurements, DY

Postby Ryan @ GWR » Thu Sep 14, 2017 2:12 pm

Making the oil cooler work around the supercharger setup

Oil temps when tracking the ND when it was naturally aspirated made it clear that an oil cooler was a must. Now with the supercharger added to the mix, cooling the oil is even more of a do-or-die affair.

We had to make some changes to the Mishimoto oil cooler kit to fit with the added intercooler and intake piping from the supercharger. This is a DIY process.

The cooler location must shift a bit, which places it where you can't have the lines enter it from the top - so the cooler is flipped up-side down with in/out pointing down. We like this orientation more anyways because it drains when you turn the engine off so that when you change your oil you aren't left with a whole cooler's worth of dirty oil still in the system. You'll need to figure out the brackets for the cooler's new position. We used a couple of the brackets from the Mishimoto kit and a couple other random brackets that were laying around.

With cooler flipped and relocated you need new lines. The new lines we made are both -10AN in size with 45° fittings on the end that joins the thermostat plate at the motor and 90° end at the cooler. Line lengths were 42" and 31".

IMG_7431.jpg


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Re: PROJECT ND: Parts Development, Testing, Measurements, DY

Postby Brian » Sat Sep 16, 2017 3:27 pm

Trans and Diff Cooling....TESTING.

The Gobal Cup cars are normally aspirated and yet run upgraded fluid coolers for the engine, separate powered fluid coolers for trans, and yet another separate powered fluid cooler for differential. And that's for race NDs that are normally aspirated!
cupcarcool.jpg


The added level of weight and complexity is horrifying to us here as Racers in love with our LIGHT sports cars. So, we will go that complex only if we absolutely must, will start with more KISS methods first (Keep it Simple Stupid). If our KISS methods shown here work, it will be very easy to make these a simple product that track users can bolt on to their NDs. With our NC race cars we were able to make our differential and transmissions live at much higher power levels than most track users...with simply getting more AIR on them using similar technique. So, we are well into a similar journey here to see if we can solve our diff and trans temp challenges with just more air. We have run temp stickers on both trans and diff, and now boost is added along with air scoops, hope to see no increase in peak temps.
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Re: PROJECT ND: Parts Development, Testing, Measurements, DY

Postby Brian » Sun Sep 17, 2017 6:10 pm

First Autocross Test....SCCA

Classic tale of too many variables changed in prep for today. Added OSGIKEN limited slip to handle the higher HP, it has a much more aggressive lockup than stock and since it is new and tight it is even more aggressive. Also new alignment with less toe out, in preparation for big track events starting with MazFest next week and Mazda Raceway Laguna Seca soon after. Those two factors together meant car front didn't rotate around the cones as smoothly as the last two events. Finally the supercharger, on E85 without a finished tune because the ECUTEK software locked up during three reflash attempts by Mat of Orange Virus....such that we don't have a final HP result on this car, we are stuck for the moment with crude starting calibration while Mat builds updated calibration from scratch. In the meantime, Ecutek promising major updates this next week. From diver's seat our exhaust and wind means you cannot easily hear the supercharger, I can hear it as drive, but camera doesn't pick it up well. But camera in the nose picks up the blower sounds I know many of you are waiting to hear.

Enjoy!




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Re: PROJECT ND: Parts Development, Testing, Measurements, DY

Postby NathanD277 » Sun Sep 17, 2017 6:54 pm

The blower sounds good, and the car looks like it's picking up speed very quickly. How did the trans and diff cooler scoops work?
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Re: PROJECT ND: Parts Development, Testing, Measurements, DY

Postby Brian » Sun Sep 17, 2017 6:58 pm

NathanD277 wrote:The blower sounds good, and the car looks like it's picking up speed very quickly. How did the trans and diff cooler scoops work?


Have not been under the car tonight to check the temp data stickers, but expect not a big heat load today with just SCCA autocross. The real test for the air scoops is next weekend....MazFest track day at always HOT Fontana.
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Re: PROJECT ND: Parts Development, Testing, Measurements, DY

Postby Brian » Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:02 pm

Looked at question today about set screw to lever that operates the bypass valve for the supercharger. It is factory set, no need to touch it. It is set so it barely touches the lever and then an extra quarter turn. Any more and you are dumping boost. The function is to be a stop that helps slow wear on the flap inside the blower which is slamming shut in a fraction of a second. It is not the end of the world if lever is not hitting the stop screw, but it does help slow wear of bypass valve flap over the long term.
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Re: PROJECT ND: Parts Development, Testing, Measurements, DY

Postby Brian » Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:27 pm

Lots of questions about amount of boost. This is where it gets interesting! Our dyno is very close to sea level, those at higher elevations will see lower boost than we get here. Our RF did as much as 13 PSI with totally stock exhaust system, 12psi with our standard length RoadsterSport header and smallish stock midpipe. Our Race ND in this thread with same pulley only does 8 Psi... yet even 'untuned' the first power pull numbers for this car were HIGHER than our RF. So, that's 8psi makes more power than 12 psi! Does that bend your brain? How is that possible?

The 2.5 bar Bosche sensor is in the manifold for the blower. Thus, our sensor position is really measuring back pressure...not telling us cylinder pressure. Skyactiv head is extremely tight, all the air is pushed through two very small holes per cylinder (one larger and one smaller port but both small compared to MZR motors). We normally think of more PSI to make more power, and that is true if 'all other things are equal' but once we open flow through the head and out the exhaust we massively reduce back pressure in the supercharger manifold and the sensor there shows lower pressure because the air the supercharger is trying to push into the cylinders and into the exhaust is getting there with much less resistance. This car has a ported and polished head that flows as much as 40% better. Thus, in this case, lower PSI does NOT equate to less power, there are actually more air molecules getting into the cylinder and making more power despite the lower PSI in the manifold. It does mean lots of custom tune work to get the tune right, more logging work later today, hope to get back to dyno for numbers late next week.
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Re: PROJECT ND: Parts Development, Testing, Measurements, DY

Postby NathanD277 » Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:26 pm

So, what you’re saying is that you’re now working on a 13# pulley setup for the race ND? :)

Is this the old head that you decided was hogged out too much for NA? Now, with boost to fill the cylinders at low engine speeds, you wanted to give it another shot?
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Re: PROJECT ND: Parts Development, Testing, Measurements, DY

Postby Brian » Thu Sep 21, 2017 2:38 pm

Yes! Page 12 is the ported and flowed data for the head...up to 40% more flow at some test points, indeed it proved too much for normal aspiration but now that we are blown it offers far less restriction to the boost.
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Re: PROJECT ND: Parts Development, Testing, Measurements, DY

Postby awales74 » Thu Sep 21, 2017 3:57 pm

This thread is more riveting than Game of Thrones. Don't know if i'll ever get the coin for FA on my ND. But I can't wait to see the updates :)
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