Back in Winning Blue. Our 'new' Project Blue!

Miata Parts, Intakes, Superchargers, Headers, Exhausts, Shocks, Springs, Sway Bars, Brake Kits, Autocross and track mods.

Re: Back in Winning Blue. Our 'new' Project Blue!

Postby Brian » Mon Dec 03, 2012 12:17 pm

Got a few emails asking 'what's next for Project Blue?' The supercharger will get on it eventually, but in the meantime testing lots of fun things.

Here is the latest example. We get headers all the time that other companies want us to test without posting results. Some of the designs work well, but most don't work out near as well as the models we already sell. This NC 4-2-1 design actually came from a customer and is standard length (bolts to factory midpipe) and came with an interesting back story:

"Custom made by 'PTR Exhausts' company, the designer and fabricators of 2012 formula 3 exhausts for Nissan CALSONIC, and have won a round of the European F3 in 2012. They made this as a prototype for a customer but it was too expensive to put into production. It is the only one ever made.... This has been dyno tested and proved to have more mid-range power and torque than the aftermarket 4 into 1 version and with a map produced over 20 more horsepower than a standard manifold."

Okay, got my attention enough to test it. Assuming the back story is accurate I can see why it was deemed too expensive to mass produce, lots of complex short sections. But if it did work we might be able to re-engineer it to bring down the costs. Before anybody gets excited and starts posting this everywhere (please don't), understand we have seen similar claims before that never seem to pan out on the dyno. Nonetheless, we are up for the challenge! Will run it against our 4-1 RoadsterSport Max Power header and see how it goes. Stay tuned...
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Re: Back in Winning Blue. Our 'new' Project Blue!

Postby Chuck H » Tue Dec 04, 2012 9:28 am

Not an exhaust engineer, but from the looks of that header, some of the extra mid-range torque may be coming from the smaller diameter primaries compared to most of the 4-1 designs. I've noticed that most of the MX5 headers use fairly large primaries, which is generally better for top end power, but may give up a little bit of mid-range torque because the exhaust loses velocity too quickly. If you do a 4-2-1 header right, the primaries can be a little smaller to keep velocity high even at lower RPM, then merge into larger secondaries that help keep it from being too restrictive as the flow goes up with RPM.
2012 Copper Red Touring
Progress springs and sways
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Re: Back in Winning Blue. Our 'new' Project Blue!

Postby AZ Sun Lover » Tue Dec 04, 2012 7:47 pm

Hmm,
Any clearance issues with the heat shield for the brake system on the right side?

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Re: Back in Winning Blue. Our 'new' Project Blue!

Postby Brian » Tue Dec 04, 2012 9:03 pm

AZ Sun Lover wrote:Hmm,
Any clearance issues with the heat shield for the brake system on the right side?

AZ


Wow, good guess. To avoid rattle, we had to very slightly bend back the factory shield that protects the brake lines.
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Re: Back in Winning Blue. Our 'new' Project Blue!

Postby Brian » Wed Dec 05, 2012 9:17 am

Well, I am disappointed. I was really looking forward to having an excuse to re-engineer something much this 4-2-1 Tri-Y design to make something like this affordable to make. We get a lot of requests for a Tri-Y from folks who are convinced it will make more torque...because theory tells them so. I was looking forward to making those customers happy by offering the option. Well, sorry, but it does not make an ounce more torque or hp. And this is a REALLY well designed Tri-Y, I really don't see much room for improvement in it. Thus, overall I can't expect a much better result from a Tri-Y that fits the factory midpipe than what we see here, they did a really nice job on it. I do much like the sound it makes, more heavy purr than the aggressive rip our 4-1 makes. But investing the money to make a more complex header that will end up costing $50 to $100 more just for the nicer sound? Hmm, you guys tell me but my gut says not worth the effort if we can't make any more torque at all?

Thus, my bottom line conclusion so far is that for a bolt in header that works with factory midpipe our RoadsterSport Max Power 4-1 header is still top dog and getting any more torque requires the approach seen in our PPE Long tube (custom midpipe to allow MUCH longer primaries). I have no plans to do anything like our PPE long tube because our friends at PPE already did it, and did a masterful job of it....and the market for such a high end piece that requires a custom midpipe is obviously very limited anyway. For those interested, we have another batch of PPE Long Tubes ready to ship later this week.

Here is the chart, low line is best stock. Then we added our Roadstersport header, midpipe and RoadsterSport 2 exhaust and did three runs resulting in the best for this configuration, which is the BLUE line. As usual, we get over 20 hp to a best of 166 with our RoadsterSport Max Power Header with massive torque gains from idle to redline (that is a fun consistent result since many years ago our very first NC also made 166 max at the wheels with our 4-1 header). Best result with the Tri-Y header is the green line, which tracks our 4-1 almost perfectly from idle to redline with no gains anywhere as compared to our existing 4-1 design.
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Re: Back in Winning Blue. Our 'new' Project Blue!

Postby RobertS272 » Tue Dec 11, 2012 1:19 pm

Brian, many thanks for the prompt service. I ordered my ''Q'' on the 4th Dec and it arrived on the morning of the 11th in Sydney . One hour later it was fitted.
I'm sure that a muffler alone doesn't make an NC go faster, but I swear it has. I have great faith in the seat of my pants. Anyway I love the subtle change of note, and I look forward to purchasing mid pipe in the new year.
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Re: Back in Winning Blue. Our 'new' Project Blue!

Postby Brian » Wed Dec 12, 2012 5:05 pm

Hi Rod,

That's great, much enjoy hearing that folks are enjoying our products. Happy Motoring!
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Re: Back in Winning Blue. Our 'new' Project Blue!

Postby JamesK383 » Sat Dec 15, 2012 4:35 pm

Brian,

I am interested/curious about the NC FRONT Splitter.

But I can't find enough photos on the web that demonstrate the fit.

Any chance you could be convinced to fit one up to your winning blue project and post photos for the site?
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Re: Back in Winning Blue. Our 'new' Project Blue!

Postby Brian » Thu Jan 24, 2013 4:18 pm

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Re: Back in Winning Blue. Our 'new' Project Blue!

Postby DavidP020 » Sun Jan 27, 2013 6:39 am

In which conditions do you think an upgraded radiator is needed?

With a rotrex supercharger at 10 PSI, is an improved radiator needed for track days?

I think, a driver should first install a FI and see if temperature raises before thinking of buying a new radiator.
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